[gpva-ic] Re: [gpva-business] NOVA Stuff

[charles murn]

I think this too falls under the category of "Jim's law" . . . .

----- Original Message -----
From: <jimpolk at cavtel.net>
To: <gpva-ic at vagreenparty.org>
Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2003 7:30 PM
Subject: Re: [gpva-ic] Re: [gpva-business] NOVA Stuff


> Hello IC,
> Comments to the IC ARE NOT supposed to be posted to the business list.
> Members of the IC that intentionally post their IC comments to the
> business list need to stop.  We have the IC to try to limit the discussion
> to get things done. If IC members cannot stick to this, then their local
> will be asked to get a new IC member.
> Jim Polk, Co-Chair
> Green Party of Virginia
>
> > David,
> >
> > You are absolutely right. It is up to those claiming a problem to show
> > that
> > there were settled rules of some sort. They have the burden of proof.
> >
> > My feeling is that if they can show rules that were broken, they are
> > entitled to NOVA's affiliation. If they can't, they lose the
affiliation.
> > It
> > may not even be necessary to vote in the IC on it. But then, the people
> > involved may negotiate an outcome that will moot our discussion.
> >
> > Charles Murn
> > CVG
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "David R. Gaines" <davidgainesusa at yahoo.com>
> > To: <gpva-ic at vagreenparty.org>
> > Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2003 4:11 PM
> > Subject: Re: [gpva-ic] Re: [gpva-business] NOVA Stuff
> >
> >
> >> Charles, I think you're giving too much credit to the NoVa local,
which,
> > according to my
> >> observations over the last couple of years, has been run VERY
> >> informally.
> > I doubt that they can
> >> prove anything along these lines, but perhaps (I hope) Jim Lowenstern
> >> can
> > provide something to
> >> indicate otherwise.
> >>
> >> DG
> >> Loudoun Greens
> >>
> >>
> >> --- charles murn <cmurn at hotmail.com> wrote:
> >> > I think it is premature to hold an IC meeting on this question. As
per
> > my
> >> > email to the business list, there still needs to be a determination
> > whether
> >> > the surprise participants at the NOVA meeting followed other existing
> > rules,
> >> > even unwritten rules (the constitution of the British commonwealth, I
> > might
> >> > point out, is not written!). Until that inquiry determines whether
> >> other
> >> > rules that bylaws were followed, it is premature to declare the
> > decisions
> >> > made to have been legitimate and, therefore, to decide there is
> >> grounds
> > for
> >> > suspending affiliation.
> >> >
> >> > Charles Murn
> >> > CVG
> >> >
> >> > ----- Original Message -----
> >> > From: "Scott Burger" <burp at mindspring.com>
> >> > To: <gpva-ic at vagreenparty.org>
> >> > Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2003 10:11 PM
> >> > Subject: Re: [gpva-ic] Re: [gpva-business] NOVA Stuff
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > > I agree.
> >> > > Thanks,
> >> > > Scott
> >> > > www.richmondgreens.org
> >> > >
> >> > > On Tuesday, December 9, 2003, at 10:11 PM, Eric Sheffield wrote:
> >> > >
> >> > > > Hello Jim,
> >> > > >
> >> > > > I think you are quite right to not take a position on this
matter.
> >> > > > Your
> >> > > > job as chair is to act as a facilitator in resolving the
conflict.
> >> > > >
> >> > > > I would like to formally propose to the IC that:
> >> > > >
> >> > > >
> >> > > > Affiliation with the GPVA be temporarily withdrawn from the NOVA
> > local.
> >> > > >
> >> > > >
> >> > > > Thanks,
> >> > > >
> >> > > > Eric Sheffield
> >> > > > Rockbridge Greens
> >> > > >
> >> > > >
> >> > > >
> >> > > >
> >> > > > jimpolk at cavtel.net wrote:
> >> > > >>
> >> > > >> Hello Gang, especially David Gaines,
> >> > > >>
> >> > > >> This NOVA stuff is really sucking up a lot of our time and
energy
> > and
> >> > > >> I
> >> > > >> supposed it will continue to do so for the next few days.
> >> > > >>
> >> > > >> I spoke to Jim Lowenstern, who I have the greatest respect for.
> >> > > >> However,
> >> > > >> Jim informed me that NOVA Greens had NO bylaws.
> >> > > >>
> >> > > >> This leaves anyone who shows up to a meeting able to do pretty
> >> much
> >> > > >> whatever they want to. This was an official meeting of the NOVA
> >> > > >> Greens. At
> >> > > >> that official meeting, a new chair and steering committee were
> >> > > >> elected.  I
> >> > > >> was not there. Carey is accused by some reliable people to have
> >> > > >> approached
> >> > > >> the whole process violently. Even so, that does not negate the
> >> > > >> validity of
> >> > > >> what happened.
> >> > > >>
> >> > > >> I have personally received many emails from people who are
> > registered
> >> > > >> with
> >> > > >> NOVA wanting to know what to do. I have asked them to be patient
> > for
> >> > > >> a few
> >> > > >> days.
> >> > > >>
> >> > > >> I have heard a lot of chatter on this topic over the past few
> >> days
> > on
> >> > > >> the
> >> > > >> phone and on the listserv. I have been sitting on the fence
> >> > > >> intentionally
> >> > > >> so let the debate run its course. I guess as Co-Chair I am
> >> supposed
> >> > > >> to be
> >> > > >> a mediator for this, while SOME expect and are asking me to make
> >> a
> >
> >> > > >> decision and take a stand and step in and do something.
> >> > > >>
> >> > > >> I will do this in the next day or two.
> >> > > >>
> >> > > >> But, so far the easiest solution I see is to disaffiliate the
> >> NOVA
> >> > > >> Greens.
> >> > > >> Then at the next business meeting,
> >> > > >>
> >> > > >> [which I am proposing be the first weekend in February (Kirit
> >> says
> > he
> >> > > >> needs a few extra days to get ready) and this still lets us have
> > the
> >> > > >> meeting during the legislative session]
> >> > > >>
> >> > > >> Jim Lowenstern or someone else from the old NOVA can ask for
> >> > > >> affilitation,
> >> > > >> and get it or not. Boom done.
> >> > > >>
> >> > > >> Carey Campbell or someone else can also ask for affiliation of a
> > Green
> >> > > >> Local, and get it or not. Boom done.
> >> > > >>
> >> > > >> Some feel, as I do, that the local level folks should solve
this.
> > But
> >> > > >> I am
> >> > > >> not really sure that another local is the right group to sort
out
> > the
> >> > > >> problems of another local. I feel it is the state organizations
> >> to
> >> > > >> clear
> >> > > >> things like this up.
> >> > > >>
> >> > > >> I also feel that time is important, as we have so many important
> >> > > >> issues
> >> > > >> coming up, i.e. presidential stuff, house of representatives,
> > running
> >> > > >> statewide candidates for governor, lt. governor and attorney
> > general
> >> > > >> in
> >> > > >> 2005...
> >> > > >>
> >> > > >> I will be convening the IC to examine this manner of the NOVA
> > Greens
> >> > > >> early
> >> > > >> next week.
> >> > > >>
> >> > > >> Jim Polk, Co-Chair GPVA
> >> > > >>
> >> > > >> _______________________________________________
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> >> > >
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> >>
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